Space / Universe .. what is really going on

non-computer related scientific discussions go here. how does stuff work, how far is moon from sun, how do monorail trains work ..etc

Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby Sethioz » Thu Oct 25, 2012 5:45 pm

Recently i started thinking about universe and read a lot about it from wiki and other sources.
so i made this topic. post your theories and thoughts about universe here and some feedback about my ideas / theories.

most believed theory is that whole universe started out from a single, hot spot. like explosion kind of thing. that is called "The Big Bang" theory, which in fact makes most sense.
based on redshifts they say that universe is expanding, but on slower rate than it was expanding before.
scientists also claim that universe is about 13.5 billion years old (if i remember correctly).

Now there is interesting theory, which i don't really think is true, but kind a makes sense.
they say that "observable universe" is always the same size. what i don't understand, is what is the limit of observation?!
IF you have technology that can zoom in indefinetly, then you should be able to see end of universe.
or what they are saying, is that all the planets, form a "wall" where you can't see past, no matter in what position planets are.
what i mean, is that if you go in straight line, sooner or later you would collide with something, either if its a planet or meteor.


If you ask me, how universe was "created" and if it has an end or "what's really out there", I'm 99.99% sure that i know the answer.
that big bang theory is most likely correct, meaning i agree with that.
what's out there? > i think that universe is a sphere and it has outer line, but what's outside that ? .. another universe and another...etc
but how long does it go on ? > i think that universes are part of something a lot bigger, something humans can't even imagine, but what's outside that? and how long does it go on ... well no idea.

why i think like that?
take a look around. what does atom consist of ? it is just like a solar system, it has a core (sun) and electrons orbiting the core (like planets).
it's all the same. now think, if earth would be 1 electron around 1 atom, then how far would humans be able to see ?
lets say that atom is part of some huge structure.
see where im going?
i mean, atom, planets, solar systems, galaxies...work the same, the bigger they go, the slower they move.
so why would universe be something else than a sphere ?
in fact i can say im 100% sure universe is sphere shaped and not a box or a flat line ..etc


.. kind a interesting stuff all that universe and how people calculate the stuff.
I keep thinking about some stuff .. and don't understand why scientists have not done anything like that before.
they can observe the universe and predict stuff, why won't they input all that into computer and make a universe simulator and then reverse it and see how it all started ?!
at least i never heard of anyone doing that. they could just make a simulator and either reverse it or accelerate it. there is no need to see beyond the observable universe, if simulator is exact replica of observable universe, then they can accelerate it like 1-2 years and see if everything that happens in simulator also happens in real universe (which im sure will if its exact replica), then simply reverse the process and see where it all started OR accelerate it even more (like 13.5 billion years) and they should be able to see how big universe really is.
im quite sure im not first one to think of this, but why there is no documentation of anyone doing something like that .. hmm. are they hiding something? cmon, i can't be first one to come up with such idea.


edit:
somewhere i also saw that NASA (or some other observers) have gone further in observation than ever before and results will be revealed in late 2012 .. hmm
User avatar
Sethioz
Admin
Admin
 
Posts: 4757
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 5:11 pm
Location: unknown

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby KEN » Thu Oct 25, 2012 8:13 pm

I'm also a big bang theory believer, it just makes perfect sense or maybe string theory is just too complicated so I never paid much attention to it and never understood it well enough.

What I believe more in is the reverse gravitation which is said to have been present before the big bang occured.Meaning that before the universe began, there was a reverse gravity pulling everything towards it during the center and then big bang happens and pushed everything far away leaving the "small" stuff with their own gravitation pull.The impact of the big bang might be the reason for universe to constantly expand during our present time?

somewhere i also saw that NASA (or some other observers) have gone further in observation than ever before and results will be revealed in late 2012

I highly doubt NASA will reveal any good stuff to the public other than "we found a new galaxy nearby; a planet similar in characteristics of Earth discovered; planets with 2 moons makes it look like a pair of boob in sky;"
User avatar
KEN
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 756
Joined: Thu Jan 28, 2010 8:11 am

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby Legu » Fri Oct 26, 2012 12:08 pm

scientists also claim that universe is about 135 billion years old (if i remember correctly).

No u dont, it is 13.75 billion years old.
User avatar
Legu
Allie
Allie
 
Posts: 232
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2011 6:47 pm

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby Sethioz » Fri Oct 26, 2012 1:52 pm

Legu wrote:scientists also claim that universe is about 135 billion years old (if i remember correctly).

No u dont, it is 13.75 billion years old.


stop trying to look smart, you took it off of wiki and i made a typo. there was suppouse to be a comma (13.5) not 135. if you would know 10% of what i know, you wouldn't remember each detail that well either or make small typos.
i didn't copy it off of wiki while writing this, because i wanted to put all this in my own words.
User avatar
Sethioz
Admin
Admin
 
Posts: 4757
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 5:11 pm
Location: unknown

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby Legu » Fri Oct 26, 2012 2:48 pm

Sorry for writting the right number. I thought it might be helpful. Wont happen again.
User avatar
Legu
Allie
Allie
 
Posts: 232
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2011 6:47 pm

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby Sethioz » Fri Oct 26, 2012 5:05 pm

it's ok to correct, but this wasn't really the discussion here and that was pretty much all you said. i made this topic more to talk about universe in general.
User avatar
Sethioz
Admin
Admin
 
Posts: 4757
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 5:11 pm
Location: unknown

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby Legu » Fri Oct 26, 2012 5:36 pm

Well when we are already talkin about such things i wonder if we will ever be able to tell what really happend in the "0th" second. As far as i know we can only say what happend in the 0,0000(insert many zeros here)0001 second. Also ive heard about theories that say that the universe will one day stop expending due to the fact that it will have enough mass and in fact it will start to contract. First very slowly than quicker and quicker, so that universes will come near to each other ultimately everything will merge for the universe will no longer be large enough for separate galaxies or stars. As it continues to shrink, the universe will heat to huge temperatures, and everything will be compacted into something similar like a black hole. After that the whole "thing" would be a very very small very dense also very "hot" point. After that everything could be possible. Something like another "Big Bang" or just true "nothingness".(Why is there something rather than nothing?) Either way it seems like that we are going to get fucked. Or not. Mybe its just a loop and humans have been generated for like "1000 Big Bangs".
User avatar
Legu
Allie
Allie
 
Posts: 232
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2011 6:47 pm

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby Sethioz » Fri Oct 26, 2012 10:02 pm

i haven't heard that, but i know that black holes are expanding and "eating" whole galaxies.
black holes are another interesting things actually, where even light is effected by gravity. its very interesting and confusing at same time.

however all that points to that universe is just part of something huge that is also collapsing slowly.
in fact that loop theory is something ive had in mind too, that maybe this whole thing is a big loop, big bang > universe ..etc and then it collapses back to nothing, all galaxies, planets, suns ..etc get pulled together and then another big bang and it starts all over. eh, who knows.
but it sure is interesting.
User avatar
Sethioz
Admin
Admin
 
Posts: 4757
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 5:11 pm
Location: unknown

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby Legu » Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:03 am

Well lets assume that the loop theory is true. If it is true there are 2 options.
1.) After the bing bang, some random shit happens, so that from our point of view new universes get generated that "dont exist" in the phase space we are in now. But even then it might be possible that something like "earth" could happen.

2.) The other option is that every "Big Bang" looks like exactly the same and due to that for a funny reason we as well would get generated like "infinity" times as well. It kinda scares me though because then it would mean that we are nothing better than some stones lying on a street.

Also speaking about "random" events, i dont know if true "randomness" really exists. Takinga a java random generator it really seems to generate random numbers. However to think about it, it uses mathematical alrogithms, that eventhough do seem to make "randomness" but somehow they are generated by pure logic. 1 or 0. So idk. But even if randomness doesnt exist it might be possible that after every Big Bang just a little something changes so that it makes "life" impossible. However i think it is like going on a road along for a long time. If you do exactly the same thing everytime u might end up eventually from there where u started of. In our case it would mean life, furthermore it would mean that we could exist "again". Fucked up for sure.
User avatar
Legu
Allie
Allie
 
Posts: 232
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2011 6:47 pm

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby Sethioz » Sat Oct 27, 2012 11:57 pm

reason why i say that big bang is what happend, is because of everything else around us. everything works the same way. atom and electrons around it.

somehow i think that the cycle is almost identical. i got this idea because of people who are able to see future in some form. there are many cases, where someone is able to see what happens (i have seen some stuff myself that comes true, not once, not twice, but more. like i wake up hearing my phone ring, i pick up my phone, look on screen..nothing, i check call history, nothing .. and then in few seconds it does ring or i wake up hearing car crash outside, i go to window, nothing, then when i start going back, car does crash.. things like that)
and i think these kind of things, come from the previous cycle, that some kind of energy that our technology is not able to pick up yet, is left here from previous cycle and some people are able to pick it up and see it somehow.

some people may call it just a hunch, but ive seen and heard lot of stories of psychics who are not fake.
this is why I think that universe repeats itself after some time.

however i still think that it is possible to make space simulator, that simulates the whole space and then it would be possible to fast forward it or reverse it, to see what would happen.
User avatar
Sethioz
Admin
Admin
 
Posts: 4757
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 5:11 pm
Location: unknown

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby Legu » Sun Oct 28, 2012 10:31 am

" i got this idea because of people who are able to see future in some form. there are many cases, where someone is able to see what happens (i have seen some stuff myself that comes true, not once, not twice, but more."

Lets assume an array of "bing bangs of 5"

1st bing bang + related future = lets say its the actual "first" one.
2nd = it could be "our" current one...u have some memories from the previous one, like where a car crashed, which made u go to the window, but then going bk and right after it u hear the crash.
3rd = in this one, u should actually have memories about urself goin bk from the window and hearin the car crash making u do smt different like in the "2nd" one. Like waiting a bit longer at the window.
4th = Could be anything however it would relate to the 3rd one
5th = same idea with the 4th

So using this idea for "n" bing bangs we can say that if u are observing the n-th bing bang, u have memories from the n-1 bing bang. Problem is, what if n=0. Or even if n=1. In a version of ur life without a previous bing bang, u should have no "6th" sense stuff like predicting something that will happen. Strange.
User avatar
Legu
Allie
Allie
 
Posts: 232
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2011 6:47 pm

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby Sethioz » Sun Oct 28, 2012 2:40 pm

what is "bing bang" ??

well there is definetly more to universe than nowdays science can detect. all those cases about ghosts and other paranormal activities, i think they are related to previous universe cycle somehow. some kind of "radiation" or something that our technlogy is not able to read yet.
User avatar
Sethioz
Admin
Admin
 
Posts: 4757
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 5:11 pm
Location: unknown

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby Legu » Sun Oct 28, 2012 8:53 pm

As much i think about it as worse it gets. A cycle for me is a chain where the first element equals the last one ... like a --> b --> c --> d ---> a .... Now if that is true it means 2 things.

1.) All the elements are already defined. At first it seems unreleveant but if u think about it, it would mean that the future is already written. Anything u do, is already planned, in fact mybe it already happend.

2.) If it is really a cycle, it still needs a beginning. But anyhow i think about it, even with the big bang, it requires something.
2.1.) Big bang needs a lot of mass pointed in one point.
2.2) Religion needs a god or many gods.
2.3) Other theories needs stuff as well.

Doesnt matter how u look at it, there is something that makes the beginning of the things we know. And it seems there is no way we can find out where this stuff comes from. Even "nothingness" needs something. It needs an array of "nothing", generally said, it is a set where all the elements are missing. What can we conclude from all the data we know yet? Not much.
User avatar
Legu
Allie
Allie
 
Posts: 232
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2011 6:47 pm

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby KEN » Sun Oct 28, 2012 9:55 pm

Legu wrote:2.1.) Big bang needs a lot of mass pointed in one point..

Reverse gravitation which existed before the big bang explains that.

We could be a part of just some experiment of some super powerfull alien / god.
We the slaves carry out his little little work in this big universe.

Anyone have any views or wanna talk about parallel universe?
User avatar
KEN
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 756
Joined: Thu Jan 28, 2010 8:11 am

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby Sethioz » Mon Oct 29, 2012 6:38 pm

depends what you call a "god".
that experiment idea .. i doubt it is true. i don't think there is a creator who made universe, i think it's just all natural, but what's outside of universe and outside that ..etc, no idea.
but it might be true that whole universe is just experiment made by a lot bigger species.
User avatar
Sethioz
Admin
Admin
 
Posts: 4757
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 5:11 pm
Location: unknown

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby KEN » Fri Nov 02, 2012 5:24 pm

About parallel universe. If they are "parallel", does it mean that they can never collide with our universe? I friend asked me this.
User avatar
KEN
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 756
Joined: Thu Jan 28, 2010 8:11 am

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby Sethioz » Fri Nov 02, 2012 5:54 pm

that depends how you define parallel, parallel by definition is "side by side", but just because 2 cars drive side by side, doesn't mean they can't collide, but i think that when people (scientists) say parallel universe, they mean the theoretical parallel as there is another universe existing at same time as ours and advancing at same speed ..etc as ours, but not actually having a parallel universe somewhere out there. like a ghostly thing, like spirit world..etc

if it really is physical universe, side by side with ours, then ofcourse they can collide.
User avatar
Sethioz
Admin
Admin
 
Posts: 4757
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 5:11 pm
Location: unknown

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby KEN » Sat Nov 03, 2012 8:30 am

And universe is constantly expanding. So even if they are parallel, "side by side" still they should collide at some point. So if they collide will the universe fall apart or what? any guesses?
User avatar
KEN
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 756
Joined: Thu Jan 28, 2010 8:11 am

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby Sethioz » Sat Nov 03, 2012 6:01 pm

as i said, don't think this is what people mean under parallel.

1. universes exist at same time, in same place, except that in like some 4th dimension, so physically they can't collide (unless there is some kind of technology to travel between them, something similar to what was in the move "The One")

2. universes exist side by side, just like atoms in an everyday object. if universe expands, then it would have pretty much same effect as like steel expanding when it gets hot and shrinking when cooling down. i personally think this is the case, because it makes a lot more sense. universe is just part of something huge, that acts just like everyday objects in our world. so if that's the case, then universe can easily collapse when that huge object reaches the breaking point.

however most scientists and people think that they can't collide physically, least that's what i heard and read. .. but again it makes bit sense, this is where all those ghosts come from, somehow they break thru from another universe, but then again .. they can come from that "side by side" universe too. blah who knows ..maybe in 20 years we have the answer, since technology evolves on a much faster rate than it used to. i mean .. look, in 80s there were almost no computers, 20 years later there are so powerful machines that they couldn't even dream of and 10 more years later (now) we have things that we can't even name anymore, because they evolve so fast.


this is bit offtopic, but lets assume that we are able to travel billions of times faster than light can and we have technology that has infinite zooming capabilities, what would happen if you fly over 13 billion times ahead of light, in other words travel as far as light have reached within the time that universe have existed and then look back into center of universe ... in theory you would see the creation of universe, but then again .... if you go further than light have ever reached, then what is there?? is there anything at all, it should be outside the universe then.
im guessing this time is not far when they are able to make something that goes faster than light.
User avatar
Sethioz
Admin
Admin
 
Posts: 4757
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 5:11 pm
Location: unknown

Re: Space / Universe .. what is really going on

Postby Legu » Sun Nov 04, 2012 4:49 pm

im guessing this time is not far when they are able to make something that goes faster than light.


I think the key is quantum teleportation. It shouldnt be imagined like "real" teleportation where u transport the system itself. U can only transmit "qubits" (the basic unit of quantum information).
Some news about it.
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v489/n7415/full/nature11472.html
User avatar
Legu
Allie
Allie
 
Posts: 232
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2011 6:47 pm

Next

Return to Science / Technology

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron